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Getting it off the chest

Journal Entry: Sat Jun 20, 2009, 5:24 PM

I have to get something off my chest. I want to be as professional as possible here, so I will not be specific regarding names or dates. Sometimes in life, you have to step up, and call individuals on their integrity.

As many already know, my art of the Ghostbusters looks similar to that of the new Wii/PS2 art. Some of you may also know a bit of the history behind the subversive nature on how the art came to be so alike.

I had mentioned before that this issue was resolved in an amicable manner. I also noted that it was confirmed that Sony and Sierra actually gave my art as a base to work off of, directly to the the developer. However, much to my disappointment this past Tuesday, the most important part of the deal was not upheld. I was 100% guaranteed an on screen credit in the game. Not seeing the credit in the game was a huge disappointment for me.

I like many of you, love the Ghostbusters mythos. The characters are a part of our culture, and many of us have grown up with them throughout the years. I put my heart and soul into the art I create. My full passion goes into all of the Ghostbusters art I do. For a game that in many ways is heavily influenced by my work, is it too much to ask for some acknowledgment?

There is no opportunity to add my name in now, as the game is out. So, consider this my on screen credit;

Special Thanks - Dan Schoening

P.S. Thank you all for the support and feedback on my recent poll. It may be of interest to note, the art that I juxtapose against "This Chick is Toast" is offical Ghostbusters Wii art, and was done by the Lead Concept Artist on the game.

  • Mood: Optimism
  • Listening to: Jim Gaffigan
  • Reading: Revisions
  • Watching: Incredible Hulk
  • Playing: Ghostbusters (Wii)
  • Drinking: Coffee
Add a Comment:
thelearningcurv Featured By Owner Jun 27, 2009
sorry to hear about how this happened. Is there anything you can do about this? I am sure you've got some evidence to help show that they took your stuff without compensation..... sorry to hear about this man.....
studionfc Featured By Owner Jun 25, 2009
I believe it was Dan Fraga who once said that art work is the most unappreciative business there is.

I can remember when I used to do log and sign design work. I saw work of mine everywhere because people would get signs for their vehicles and t-shirts for their companies done. And while no, my name couldn't really be printed next to the logos and what have you it always kind of hurt that I saw so much of my work around town and never got any credit for it.

So I can definitely feel your pain.

Not getting credit for the work you put your heart into sucks.

I'm sorry it happened to you man.
Jared-Sol Featured By Owner Jun 24, 2009

That is all.
SherbertTCat Featured By Owner Jun 23, 2009  Hobbyist Digital Artist
I'm sorry, but I just don't see it.
Slinky22 Featured By Owner Jun 23, 2009

My name is Dan Borth and I am the CEO of Red Fly Studio and I am the person that Dan's blog entry is aimed at.

First off I would like to defend the position here at the studio that we left Dan off the credits intentionally. That's not true.

Dan's blog entry is one that is not packed with facts so I share them with all of you before you scream that I and or our studio is just an awful terrible sort of people.

I don't really appreciate people questioning my integrity but to each his own.

When we were first approached to do Ghostbusters from Vivendi at the time they gave us a large group of concept art that we were to go through. We had already decided on a stylish look for the game and there were many concepts and fan art pieces that we liked. Dan's was one of those. We started working of the art work we liked and it wasn't until later that I was contacted by Dan himself. Being an artist myself I understood his position and also wanted to make things right - since no one informed us who created the concept pieces - etc. So we reached an agreement that included money and an on screen credit. At that point his work ceased to be fan art and became our property because we paid for it.

The months went by and Dan pinged me here and there - I got back to him when I could but not always promptly. He was very supportive and excited about the game - as were we.

Fast forward some crazy months and after crunching to get the game out Dan contacts me through LinkedIn with his on screen credit grievance. I didn't respond to him in time and he started posting these blog entries about how he was cheated and that we acted unprofessionally, and how I have no integrity - etc, etc.

Leaving me with little choice but to tell the other side at the very least to people in the industry or to whom might care about such matters.

I myself am an artist - or I used to be - and I understand the anger Dan is feeling. I don't think however, it is justified and attacking me or the studio in the press was and is a wrong way to handle things.

Back to the on screen credit...after Sony, Vivendi, Atari all got their credits we had few spaces for ourselves and the others who worked on the games with us - Zen Studios, War Drum studios, etc. Was Dan's name left off? Yes it was. Was it intentional? No it wasn't. Many, many people didn't make it and they worked many, many more hours on this game than Mr. Dan I can assure you.Does that make it right? No it doesn't. That's just how it played out.

I offered to put a blog entry up on our page to correct the matter and that wasn't good enough. Our concept artist also wanted to make an art book available on the blog only and include Dan. He has refused. So to call me out like that is not really fair. The fact is we paid him and his name was left off. We tried to fix it but he wanted to go public so here we are.

Despite how I completely disagree how Dan handled this - Dan is an incredible artist and a true talent.

I personally posted this on our blog -


Which I told him we would do but he chose to vilify us publicly anyway. And of course all the game sites love a good story of how a big bad developer like us screwed the little guy. I would like to remind people that a large group of other creative people worked very hard on this game.

These are the facts guys.
Jared-Sol Featured By Owner Jun 24, 2009
So let me get this straight. In a credits roll, thanking all the people for their hard work and effort, you were forced to cut people out?

By any chance have you heard of a wonderful little thing called "speed?" Because you could have easily increased the speed of moving credits / time that credits appear on screen and put in all the names that deserved it without altering the length of the credits section itself.

You can do that in iMovie for christ's sake. I hardly think any professional studio was limited by the "space" in their credits.

This is of course assuming the CEO of a development company would go to a blog page, make an account and then tell everyone "that fact"
SherbertTCat Featured By Owner Jul 5, 2009  Hobbyist Digital Artist
Lay off, they don't owe a "fan artist" jack.
Jared-Sol Featured By Owner Jul 5, 2009
Right, except that they used his art as a basis for the art style in the game. By proxy, they used his art to build a game, and then didn't credit him.

So yeah, they do owe a "fan artist" quite a lot of "jack."
SherbertTCat Featured By Owner Jul 22, 2009  Hobbyist Digital Artist
Though not a single one of the Ghostbusters in the game looks anything like his artwork.
Jared-Sol Featured By Owner Jul 22, 2009
And yet it was clearly stated that his artwork, along with others', was used as inspiration for the art style of the game.
SherbertTCat Featured By Owner Jul 22, 2009  Hobbyist Digital Artist
Honestly, I think they were just being generous.
Pixelcreatures Featured By Owner Jun 22, 2009
I'm sorry to hear this, Dan. And your work is far better than the actual product.
EvilCatV7 Featured By Owner Jun 22, 2009
Sorry to hear this happended to you. I have yet to play the game (I usually don't play games based on movies and TV shows because they are usually bad cash-ins, but this sounds like an exception), but I can still tell you played a large part in the development.
grisser Featured By Owner Jun 21, 2009
someone digg/reddit/etcetc this already D:
jmralls2001 Featured By Owner Jun 21, 2009   General Artist
Your art is awesome, and I especially like the Ghosbusters pictures. I have several of them in my favorites.
Steelpengu Featured By Owner Jun 21, 2009  Professional Digital Artist
If it makes you feel any better, I kept thinking while playing the PS2 version that your actual designs would have been better. I really think the PS2 version looks like a bunch of slackers made it.

You're my hero when it comes to Ghostbusters art.
zack-materia-hunter Featured By Owner Jun 21, 2009
SHEEIT Man, that almost brought a tear to my eye.

I look at that Wii/PS2 Ghostbusters art and I think "That's Dan's art, right there..." Because let's face it. Who the hell were they kidding?

Your self made on screen credit will forever live on. And you're by far the most memorable name on the Ghostbuster's Wii/PS2 team without even being listed on there. Kinda ironic no? ;)
The1Blur Featured By Owner Jun 21, 2009  Hobbyist Digital Artist
man.. did u get anything in writing? cuz if so... i would call a lawyer. They didnt want to uphold a simple agreement to honor ur hard work that gave them the push they needed.. i would stick it to um!
JoaquimDossantos Featured By Owner Jun 21, 2009
That is a bummer my friend. I've seen this sort of thing happen before and I'm sure this will not be the last time it happens in our industry. Just make sure to handle yourself with class (as you seem to have been) and the truth will eventually find its way to the masses.
CaTZStudio Featured By Owner Jun 21, 2009  Professional General Artist
I find credits issue is really a problem in this industry, sometimes, the developers, even though they admit something, can't do anything if they're told otherwise by their higher ups :(

I too had similar problem (probably worst, imo) than you Dan, I designed a game from its' story, gameplay,rule and character, but the higher up of the company I work for doesn't feel obligated to put me as 'Game Designer' on the games' credits, only as '2D Artist' as that is my title/position at the company

that, in small part, what drove me to quit from that place and ended up freelance now
CarlPearce Featured By Owner Jun 21, 2009  Professional
Well, that's a bit cheeky of them.
Philbrush Featured By Owner Jun 21, 2009
That really sucks!
TWULF Featured By Owner Jun 21, 2009   Digital Artist
I've known for a while with the odd mention in your past journals that you've had your style stolen for the Wii game, it's no more blantant than their Ray concept art which is almost just like a different colour job ontop of your linework. Really disgraceful to hear that even when they admitted it, they still never credited you. I found this article aswell about the art direction on the game,


No mention ever of any other inspirations than ' Pixar '. For a while I figured, 'Fair enough, they were just inspired by his work' but now that I see the Egon and Ray concepts in particular? They didn't even try to change the pose! So to not even give you a special mention? Not cool guys. Unjust. Fight it!
fishcat101 Featured By Owner Jun 21, 2009  Professional Traditional Artist
are you kidding did they pay you for anything ,i know you love the joy having something like that turned into 3d but
that's crap.
so not buying the game ripoff artists.

you did a fantastic job ,the first time i saw your ghost busters art i was so hoping to see an animated cartoon come out of it.
all the deserve a lot of credit as the character development makes a big part of the feel of the game.
happymonkeyshoes Featured By Owner Jun 21, 2009  Professional Digital Artist
Do you want to start mention this to gaming sites such as Kotaku etc. Although they can't change anything, they can bring the issue up to the general public etc. Hell I'll do it for you!!!
AngelCrusher Featured By Owner Jun 21, 2009  Professional Filmographer
LAME! Can you sue man? You were given an agreement, they admitted what they did. It doesnt look like their character designers did do much developing after seeing your work for reference.
I know you probably want to be nice and dont think its worth the hassle, but maybe its something you should look into because it will warn alot of companies not to just steal pictures off the internet, and it will also get you credit for the game. Maybe you wont be credited IN the game, but the story it will cause of 'artist sueing game company' will make other game studios sit up and say 'oh, THAT guy designed those characters! Cool!'
Look into it man, and i wish you well.
MatteoScalera Featured By Owner Jun 21, 2009  Professional General Artist
that sucks, man.
I'm really sorry these things happen...
EggHeadCheesyBird Featured By Owner Jun 21, 2009   Digital Artist
That blows.
Sandora Featured By Owner Jun 21, 2009  Professional Filmographer
The truth will get out there like it is now. All of us who're familiar with your works will root for you and makes sure the rest realize and know it in spite of the powers that be withholding 100% information in the credit list.

I got your back,Dan.
Pinflux Featured By Owner Jun 21, 2009
That is horrible! The LEAST they could do is credit you! I hope you follow this up, this isn't acceptable!
slifertheskydragon Featured By Owner Jun 21, 2009  Hobbyist Traditional Artist

maybe ask them to put it in a special edition (if one comes out?)

i'd support a petition to add your credit in! I saw what happened from your first journal about it and the original gb work you drew, so i can understand why'd you want this (hell i'd want it too)
JediKaputski Featured By Owner Jun 20, 2009
Legal action should be taken.
OptimusPraino Featured By Owner Jun 20, 2009  Professional Digital Artist
It was official concept art?

If I was that guy, I´d feel ashamed beyond belief!

No "Special thanks"?

Those guys are big "·!$~@#~@#€#€@~€~¬ and other stuff i can´t type here...
Teben-the-Every Featured By Owner Jun 20, 2009
I didn't explore this issue enough to know if you have already been made aware or if you'd seen so yourself, but the female version of the protagonist in the Wii version of Ghostbusters IS this design [link] from top to bottom.
RedRen3 Featured By Owner Jun 20, 2009
This happens a lot I think, unfortunately. I was really looking forward to this game - not just because it was Ghostbusters, but because the art was influenced by your style - which is amazing. So when I got it, I kind of thought of it as "that awesome Ghostbusters game that Dan Schoening helped design." :XD:

So yes, despite the lack of acknowledgment on the game creators' part.. a special thanks to you. :)
DC-Tiki Featured By Owner Jun 20, 2009  Hobbyist Digital Artist
I still think they should've just hired you to do that artwork - based on the pic from your vote the other day they have ended up with second-rate stuff when compared to yours. I think it's only natural that you would want to get this off your chest, you've totally been cheated some recognition but, as hard as it must be, you also need to just let it go now so that it doesn't eat away at you from the inside. At the very least the people who follow you on devArt know what the story is now.
Superandroid23 Featured By Owner Jun 20, 2009  Hobbyist General Artist
That sucks. Big time. You would think that, when reviving a series from the dead (pun intended), they would go out of their way to include credit to artists/fans, which warranted the realization of a new chapter in the first place.
hugeackman Featured By Owner Jun 20, 2009   Digital Artist
I would suggest taking this up with a gaming news outlet, and penny arcade.
if it helps, I canceled my preorder of the ps3 version.
alufblufunk Featured By Owner Jun 20, 2009  Hobbyist Traditional Artist
truly sucks bro., karma will get em'..
Inspirrational Featured By Owner Jun 20, 2009
Cocksuckers. I hate that fucking shit.
saintpepsi Featured By Owner Jun 20, 2009  Professional Digital Artist
and it would have been so easy to add you to the credit too
TKMillerSculpt Featured By Owner Jun 20, 2009  Professional Artist
After looking closely at their art and your "This Chick is Toast" I'd say it's time for litigation. Akroyd's character couldn't be closer and Egan is pretty close behind. Doug Cheng wouldn't happen to be behind their art direction, would he? :sheepish:
JazylH Featured By Owner Jun 20, 2009  Professional Filmographer
That is so Unfair. But I hear big production houses are always unfair. :( Irrespective of that, all of us here on DA know it's your at & love it. :)
DaCommissioner Featured By Owner Jun 20, 2009
Man, that is f'ed up. I got the game for the 360, which is nothing short of amazing!!!

But I've seen the Wii version designs and you damn sure deserve credit for the Art designs.
SeishinKibou Featured By Owner Jun 20, 2009  Professional Artisan Crafter
Gehhh that's total bull that they never credited you :pissed:, Is there any way to take them to small court to just get credit on it? Or do they have evidence to say that you gave ';permission'. gehhh >_< well I'll always credit the designs as yours and just death stare the people who didnt have the decency to give you credit.
SeishinKibou Featured By Owner Jun 20, 2009  Professional Artisan Crafter
geh stupid emoticon glitch! its meant to say ' permission '
MastaAzumarek Featured By Owner Jun 20, 2009  Student Digital Artist
O_O say what!?>!?!?!?!?!?! you have got to be kidding me!! It's complete plagiarism! those lil bastards...
TMJP Featured By Owner Jun 20, 2009
That's enough for me not to buy the game.
ZEBES Featured By Owner Jun 20, 2009  Hobbyist
I totally ignore how the system works around there, but it seems is a sue-worthy scenario to me... the best of lucks for you, Dan.
ARTurkel Featured By Owner Jun 20, 2009  Professional General Artist
I will just boycott it. They can stick that in their pipe and smoke it. Bastards.
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